Carb problem

[Fineline]

'I'm rebuilding and re setting my H2 carbs to try and tame the surging and hanging rpms. There's no pin for the needle jet and the needle jet shroud seems a little mangled.
It looks like some ham fisted **** has struggled to remove it, and buggered it up.
Kawasaki had redone the carbs in May via the previous owner...hmmm.
Not sure what to do about this?

[Wolfie]

The pin looks to be there in your second picture, so the little stub may push inwards to align the Needle Jet... Either way:-

As long as you fit the Needle Jet in the correct orientation it won't move once the Brass Jet is screwed into the end.

The light damage to the pillar doesn't matter at all.

[Fineline]

There is a little bit of the pin still there but the inner part has been chopped of or something. I was going to attempt to punch it further in, to locate the needle jet, but if it doesn't matter, then all's the better. Thanks

[Wolfie]

Aye, the Jet (sometimes called the Emulsion tube) is usually a good tight fit inside the pillar so the Jet at the very bottom should be able to secure it, erm.. Securely.

They often need some tapping out, and I emphasise the 'tapping out', that one must have been well stuck, which made me think that the Jet tube itself must have also suffered.. Are all the Jet Tubes the same number? Usually a letter then a number (eg P-4).

To be fair that is an amazing amount of damage though.. as you say, someone has had a really good go at it.. it might be best to put a Carb body on your Christmas list for peace of mind.

[Fineline]

It's a shame as the carb is cosmetically quite nice on the outside. It's always worrying to open things up, as it more often than not, seems to be a can of worms.
The tube has 9.0 and some sort of hieroglyphic (must be older than I thought ) and a number 7.
I've only taken off one carb so far.
I haven't dared to look, but I dread to think what h2 carbs are going for these days. Then again H2 prices do seem to be dropping now. Well of course I just bought one.

[Charlie Morriss]

Only really looking at the info I have (I don't an H2 - only a S2A) but that suggests you may possibly be looking at the needle jet numbers upside down. You should have a number (171 in your case) and below it the funny 'square-in-square' symbol followed by the letter 'O', a dash and another number (6 in your case). See the example in the attached photo of my S2A needle jets - similarly mangled to yours (if I've got the attachment routine correct that is!).
So:

171
[symbol]O-6

[Fineline]

Ah yes you're correct. I was looking at it upside down. Luckily the other 2 carbs all have a locating pin and haven't been mangled quite so much.
Is there a recommended setting for the circlip on the needles? Mine looks to be in the middle. Also is there a fuel/air mixture screw setting too?
I noticed the idle speed screws were all cranked in quite a lot, I'm guessing that's maybe why the rpms returned slowly...
I finally finished my home made /adapted vapour blaster so was able to give em a good going over.

[skub]

Ah yes you're correct. I was looking at it upside down. Luckily the other 2 carbs all have a locating pin and haven't been mangled quite so much.
Is there a recommended setting for the circlip on the needles? Mine looks to be in the middle. Also is there a fuel/air mixture screw setting too?

Loadsa info in the resources section on the site.
https://kawatriple.com/carbspec.html

[Charlie Morriss]

Yes, Skub's right (as always)! The needle clip position seems to depend on the exact model of H2 you have. But be aware - the info is not always correct as my S2A has 214 (and not 220) needle jets fitted. This seems to be a general error in the various tables I've seen. My suspicion is that that that number refers to the length of the needle jet, although I've not seen a table saying that, in that the upper number (220, 214, 171) seems to be in inverse to the length - but that's just a guess.

As for the mangling, mine had the same issue with the locating pin in one carb but I was lucky and able to push it back in enough. The jet needles were another matter though - see the photo for the hilarious mis-match!

[Charlie Morriss]

Oh, and looking at the relevant part of the H series manual it seems that the H2 idle setting is one and a half turns out and the H2-B is one and three-quarter turns out - with a (warned up) idle speed of 1,150 - 1,250 rpm.

[Wolfie]

The Needle Clip position is the one where the Bike runs best.. Manuals and other peoples Bikes are only a Ballpark guide for yours.

And, having the little square Heiroglyph is good, that is Mikuni genuine parts.

[Fineline]

Thanks guys for all that info!
In the end, did have to punch the remainder of the pin further in, as the emulsion tube just kept moving out of position when I tightened the main jet up. Even holding it the shroud with long nose pliers "gently" (yeah I know, but it was mangled anyway ) I can see why that shroud was so beaten up now.
I may leave the circlip on the needle where it is then.

[skub]

Thanks guys for all that info!
In the end, did have to punch the remainder of the pin further in, as the emulsion tube just kept moving out of position when I tightened the main jet up. Even holding it the shroud with long nose pliers "gently" (yeah I know, but it was mangled anyway ) I can see why that shroud was so beaten up now.
I may leave the circlip on the needle where it is then.

If you've a memory anything like mine,take notes every time you make changes and give yourself a datum point you can return to if/when you get lost. It's useful info for future reference too.

[Fineline]

I try and take photos sometimes when there's god chance of going wrong.

Speaking of going wrong. I put the carbs back on and now it won't start at all. I got a couple of pops to start with then nothing. I pulled the plugs and they look very oily. In fact it seems to be dripping oil from the front of the cylinder heads/exhaust area.

[Fineline]

After checking a few things, I noticed my battery was very low. So after charging it up and cleaning the plugs, it fired right up. Sometimes it's just the simplest things.

[Wolfie]

H2 doesn't need a Battery to run, its a Self Generating type of CDI system.

Although it shouldn't be run without a Battery in circuit for any length of time. If the Carbs are set right, the Plugs should stay clean.

[Fineline]

Ah ok. The plugs do normally seem to stay clean, in the couple of rides I've had so far. I don't know if the oil pump operates off the throttle with the engine off? but there is a lot of throttle twisting when one sets the crabs up. Could it pump lots of oil in? I've read all I can find about the carb rebuilding/setting process, and followed it as accurately as I could. I'm not sure what else to do with them. I took it for a ride and the bike was smoother and less vibrating, but it still surged pretty badly when you're off the throttle in the lower gears. I just have to pull the clutch in to stop it when it happens.

[Triple Parts]

I don't know if the oil pump operates off the throttle with the engine off?

The oil pump only works when the engine is running. But it does rely on the check valves in the lines to stop oil flowing into the crankcases due to gravity.