Bike Valuations.

[Eric]

Can members give what they think the range or triples ( 250, 350, 400, 500, 750. ) are worth in Poor Condition, Average Condition, Good Condition, Very good or Excellent Condition.

Why I ask is I have no idea how to value them.

[Mitsui Spy]

KH250. Pile of crap £500, rough but complete £1000, rough but running and tested £1500, Nice and tidy £2000, Very Nice £2500, Mint £3000 IMO. Also depends on originality. I've seen rough but original and complete make nearly 2 grand. Can't comment on other models.

[Eric]

Where are all the experts gone.

[malc87]

Building

[Neil the Don]

Where are all the experts gone.

Fact is prices can be all over the place.

Some people on here would be scared to start putting prices on bikes, in case it screws them up from getting a " Bargain " !!!

Here`s a wee story as an example. I have Trade Stand at the Stafford Bike Show in both April and October.

The Original one in April is traditionally a British Bike thing. The newer one in October was created as a Jap bike show .So most KTOC and other Jap clubs only attend the October show.

I built a full resto H1-E in red with twin disc for a Customer. As it was ready just before October Stafford Show, I displayed it my stand prior to delivery , as an example of what we would sell you for £6500. While many people viewed it , and it was complimented several times ; there were also a few negative comments. ( Most were silly things. " Ooh I don`t like that clear petrol pipe < which we fit for running in to keep any eye on things, then change to black.Duh. nobody asked !! > And the classic " Well I don`t like the seat cover" You know who you are !!! ) And of course, on more than one occassion I hear people walking by , seeing the price and sneering " Huh, I sold mine for £2500 and it was much better than that ! "

So , anyway, to summarise , Octover Classic Jap bike show. A really Decent H1-E. It doesn`t seem to stand out ( Other than we tend to take 4-5 orders to build bikes from these outings )

Right. APRIL Stafford Bike Show. I started doing them when I was mainly importing British Bikes to sell. Triumph Tridents, BSAs and Nortons. ( 10 years ago, nobody much wanted to pay enough to justify briniging Kawa Triples back to sell. I used to fill my container with them and just horde them for myself !!
Last year, that lovely Red H1-E hd been delivered to it`s new owner . It had sat for 5 months unused. Then he decided he didn`t want a Triple, and could I re-sell it for him ? Sure, no probs , I`ll take it Stafford. So same bike, different Crowd.
All weekend Folk were coming up to Stand and cooing over it. Taking pictures, asking about it. Commenting on how lovely it was etc etc. I was VERY surprised at the super positive reaction. I guess as they get older the Brit Bike Crowd have dropped their prejudices against " Japcrap" I sold the bike to a very happy new Owner , nd now have even more orders to build H`-E/Fs for a new crowd of enthusiasts. And they`re all paying £1k more !!! ( Mind you, we`ve upped the specs too !! )

So, anyway Eric ; the thing is, there isn`t an exact price. It all depends on WHO you are buying/selling to and from/

I know you were looking for some kind of parameters . Only solid fact is they stopped making them 40 years ago, we`ve pretty much stripped them all out of the USA by now. And prices are going to go up and up for a year or two more.

See you at Stafford in April !!

[Eric]

I accept what you say Neil and have seen some (to put it politely) fcking stupidly high asking prices and people saying it`s well worth that or if I didn`t already have one I`d buy it. The main reason for asking my fleet is growing and for insurance purpose I need to put realistic values on them. James to be fair posted and I think was realistic with his prices but I thought others would have been brave enough to throw their hats in the ring. By the way none of mine at this moment in time are for sale and my H1a I`ve had from new cannot be bought. I am sure that my kids who have no interest in motorcycles will not have any trouble selling them though.

[JeffK]

I accept what you say Neil and have seen some (to put it politely) fcking stupidly high asking prices and people saying it`s well worth that or if I didn`t already have one I`d buy it. The main reason for asking my fleet is growing and for insurance purpose I need to put realistic values on them. James to be fair posted and I think was realistic with his prices but I thought others would have been brave enough to throw their hats in the ring. By the way none of mine at this moment in time are for sale and my H1a I`ve had from new cannot be bought. I am sure that my kids who have no interest in motorcycles will not have any trouble selling them though.

Eric,

FWIW: I knew a gal whose job it was to sell estates for the relatives of those that had passed away. She told me about all the bikes that she's sold over the years and what she told me will probably cause you pause, as it did me. She said in most cases of collections, be it cars bikes or boats, the family will "just want it done" so they end up wholesaling the entire collection for much less than it's "worth", that actual value being subjective in itself as Neil pointed out. I also have my bikes insured but have little doubt that my children, none of which know or want to know anything about bikes, would simply go the wholesale route....and enjoy the life insurance policies much more than whatever was generated from the bikes!

Feel good about one thing though, the "value" of a Kaw triple is about 20-30% higher in the UK than it is in the US for a completed bike!

jeffk

[Neil the Don]

Jeff,
Those values jump about with exchange rates. right now the mighty US dollar is artificially inflated. Hence the 20% variance ( although that is on E BAy prices perhaps, and H2s especially ? )

don't worry though, I'lll make sure Eric's kids sell. His bikes to some nasty trader like me !!

[Tartan Triple]

funny for me,i never think of value of my bikes,if i was to sell,then h1 dresda singing arm,upsidedown hagons,lesters,factory pipes,ivans needles 5k
h2a lomas pipes,rask rearsets,hagon shocks,double disks,ivans needles perhaps 8.5k.both bikes used and abused
never bought them as an investment.bought them to ride

[TallyB]

Malcolm Anderson tried to get valuations through the mag a year or two ago. He didn't get too many replies either. And yes, I was one of the few.

[malc87]

I gave up!

[S2Gerald]

I provided some input to that, but prices tend to move around anyway for a number of reasons. I have estimated values for all my bikes myself and do the same when giving values for insurance at shows. You can take a view on what bikes are advertised for and whether they sell or not. If you want a really rough guide, stick a nought on the end of the cc for usable, complete bikes and go up or down depending on condition. That said, the 350 generally commands more than a 400 and then there will be a factor for nicest/worst colour and model popularity, e.g. "Orange" KH400A3 is apparently least popular as is the H2B; some consider the S2A and S1A ugly ducklings, so they tend to be cheaper than the S2/S1. I don't expect anyone to agree with that, because it's a bit of a black art and people will pay what they think it's worth at the time. What it's worth when you come to sell it is another matter. The key thing with insurance is to get an agreed value, because that will put you in a slightly better place should you need to claim. You could try over-valuing your bikes and the insurer might cut you back; that might be your best approach, but higher values will drive up the premium. From memory, you have at least an S1A and the H1A; both are very tidy, useable machines and I think my rule of thumb applies to those (£2,500 and £5,000 respectively). This is the point where you say they're worth more, suggesting you do know what they're worth, to you at least! I'm joking with you, but hopefully my ramblings may crystalise your thoughts.

[Neil the Don]

I provided some input to that, but prices tend to move around anyway for a number of reasons. I have estimated values for all my bikes myself and do the same when giving values for insurance at shows. You can take a view on what bikes are advertised for and whether they sell or not. If you want a really rough guide, stick a nought on the end of the cc for usable, complete bikes and go up or down depending on condition. That said, the 350 generally commands more than a 400 and then there will be a factor for nicest/worst colour and model popularity, e.g. "Orange" KH400A3 is apparently least popular as is the H2B; some consider the S2A and S1A ugly ducklings, so they tend to be cheaper than the S2/S1. I don't expect anyone to agree with that, because it's a bit of a black art and people will pay what they think it's worth at the time. What it's worth when you come to sell it is another matter. The key thing with insurance is to get an agreed value, because that will put you in a slightly better place should you need to claim. You could try over-valuing your bikes and the insurer might cut you back; that might be your best approach, but higher values will drive up the premium. From memory, you have at least an S1A and the H1A; both are very tidy, useable machines and I think my rule of thumb applies to those (£2,500 and £5,000 respectively). This is the point where you say they're worth more, suggesting you do know what they're worth, to you at least! I'm joking with you, but hopefully my ramblings may crystalise your thoughts.

All quite correct. BUT, these days you need to consider the REPLACEMENT cost on bikes for insurance purposes. And those would be equivalent of going into a Shop and buying one..........heh heh.

[JeffK]

You hit the nail on the head Neil.....for insuring my bikes, I have replacement value at the time of the claim...so whatever the market is doing, I'll be able to recoup some of my money but truth be told, I didn't not buy them as an investment and how would you ever replace a bike that doesn't exist for sale any more, at any price? I asked my agent that same question and he suggested that I find a comfortable place between coverage value & premium cost that I can find livable......it's all a crapshoot anyway....hope I never need it.

jeffk

[SERPICO]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/252307735681? ... EBIDX%3AIT

This may give you some idea of what a 400 is worth when the auction ends.

[Triple Parts]

Just do an eBay search for completed listings if you want to us eBay as a measure.

[Eric]

I like your valuations Gerald and not a bad rule of thumb perhaps add £500 these days . There seems a huge variation on the values as you say but Frank seems like a good bet if he`s still buying or Bonhams at Stafford if your selling. As said I`m not selling just collecting

[S2Gerald]

Yeah, I thought afterwards that £2.5k was a bit mean for your 250. But for sure, as I said in my original post to Malcolm way back whenever, there are a lot of 250/350/400s at £5k+ sitting on ebay unsold for months. If you just want them for the enjoyment they bring you, then why worry. If I can sell a bike and recoup a big lump of what I spent, then that just helps the next project and the chase (i.e. hunting for parts and using up bits from the shed hoarded for 28 years to build a bike) is part of the enjoyment, for me at least!!

[malc87]

They are worth what someone is willing to pay, simple as.
With H2"s
A seized wreck will sell for £2500. this will have sat in a USA scrap yard for years till someone realised its potential!!
Engine and carbs will be seized and the pipes will be totally rotten!
Seat if there will be fucked and its unlikely to have any bodywork!!

A complete one with a seized engine will jump up to £5K+
Nice (ish) non runner 6K+++

maximum I have seen for a NON runner was £7500 (H2C)
Runner is 8K +

decent running resto is 10K +

good decent resto (not nut and bolt correct) is 10K to 12.5 K

A proper restored bike as in capable of getting in the top three at Nottingham is 15K +
One of the 120 british registered ones will be more!

I believe the maximum a H2 has sold for in the UK is 20K?

I turned down 20K for my NOS H2C 2 weeks after I bought it in 2004!

I just could not sell it as I had only had it two weeks
I also turned down 18K two years ago for the NOS H2B

[Eric]

Oh dear kicks your idea on values into touch Gerald

[S2Gerald]

Not really. H2s are a breed apart and prices are crazy; but if that's what people will pay....! With Malc's values ranging from £2,500 to £15,000, my rule of thumb for a half decent bike was close at £7,500 (the £20k is for a very unusual NOS bike, which I famously put in 3rd place behind two restored H2s at a Southern Rally several years ago; that also resulted in one Mr Young replacing his "pattern" mufflers with rechromed originals). Also, Malcolm has a fair bit invested in H2s, so he's bound to talk up the values :wink:.

[666rog]

Not really. H2s are a breed apart and prices are crazy; but if that's what people will pay....! With Malc's values ranging from £2,500 to £15,000, my rule of thumb for a half decent bike was close at £7,500 (the £20k is for a very unusual NOS bike, which I famously put in 3rd place behind two restored H2s at a Southern Rally several years ago; that also resulted in one Mr Young replacing his "pattern" mufflers with rechromed originals). Also, Malcolm has a fair bit invested in H2s, so he's bound to talk up the values :wink:.

Harsh but fair Gerald